Confirmed: Villanova Has Applied For ACC Membership

by Chris Lane on Sep 19, 2011 10:01 AM EDT in Big East Expansion

Nothing major (yet), and something we kind of knew already, but it is nice to hear an ACC official (better yet, the commissioner) come out and say that the ACC has been in contact with 10 additional schools, and a source confirming that Villanova did officially apply to join the ACC.

ACC Commissioner John Swofford said during a teleconference Sunday the league received more than 10 applications from schools hoping to join the league. Orlando Sentinel sources confirmed multiple Big East members applied to join the league, including Villanova.

When news first broke on Saturday that Pittsburgh and Syracuse were bolting for the ACC - the ACC confirmed that it had talked with 10 schools - but did not confirm whether Villanova was in that group. A source told us that Villanova had been in discussions with the ACC, but it's hard to take any of that seriously when we don't have an FBS football program (yet).

Right now, I think our best best of getting to the ACC would be joining with another basketball-only member (think St. John's or Georgetown) so that they wouldn't have to add more football but could continue to increase the value of their basketball product.

VUHoops reported on Saturday that Boston College Gene DiFilippo is in favor of adding Villanova to the ACC, so we have that going for us. If we're going on common sense as well, you'd imagine that BC would be against adding UConn (would split the New England market).

If there is one thing that this weekend's events showed, it's that the ACC does care about basketball. Syracuse and Pitt are okay football programs, but they are phenomenal basketball programs. That's one of the big reasons the ACC wanted them.

Hopefully, they'll want Villanova as well, because the Big East's days are numbered.

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eh...

If there is one thing that this weekend’s events showed, it’s that the ACC does care about basketball. Syracuse and Pitt are okay football programs, but they are phenomenal basketball programs. That’s one of the big reasons the ACC wanted them.

I don’t think basketball entered the conversation once in those discussions. Both Dixon and Boeheim had publicly stated they are against leaving the Big East – if basketball was such a concern you would think they would have had a seat at the table. They did not.

Good talk.
Casual Hoya

by Hire Esherick on Sep 19, 2011 10:09 AM EDT reply actions

Counter-point

If they don’t realize that the pastures are greener in the ACC (for basketball as well) then they’re fools. Sure, if they stay, Big East basketball continues to do well. But the opportunity for more football money prevailed (as it should have), and without them, the Big East is dying.

BE should have taken the TV deal they were offered, and we still might have those two schools. Once the Big East decided to wait it opened the door.

I prematurely shot my wad, if you will, on what was supposed to be a dry run, and now it looks like I have something of a mess on my hands.

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by Chris Lane on Sep 19, 2011 10:28 AM EDT up reply actions

We will see. I don’t expect Boeheim to coach one game in the ACC. Nor will Calhoun if UConn bounces. And Dixon is likely working the phones.

I think it is the exact opposite for the basketball coaches. The pastures are not greener in ACC basketball. Different style of play, different types of refs, and different recruiting pitches. Basketball coaches are not in it to make football money.

Good talk.
Casual Hoya

by Hire Esherick on Sep 19, 2011 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions

We're in agreement there

I mean from a pure $$$ perspective, they have to go to the ACC.

But I agree with you that Dixon is probably gone, and I would expect Calhoun and Boeheim to retire.

I prematurely shot my wad, if you will, on what was supposed to be a dry run, and now it looks like I have something of a mess on my hands.

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by Chris Lane on Sep 19, 2011 10:42 AM EDT up reply actions

I'd be pretty shocked if Boeheim retired

Although he does threaten it seemingly every year …

I’m sure he’s not happy about the move, but he’s also buddies with Coach K and Roy Williams. He’s good friends with Gary Williams (who’s not at Maryland anymore, but it’s someone to talk ACC with) as well.

If he retires, he was going to retire anyway, and this may be one slight factor, but I doubt it would be that major of a concern. If he wants to keep coaching basketball, he will.

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by Lots of Pulp on Sep 19, 2011 2:32 PM EDT up reply actions

I think he and Calhoun have been one foot out the door for a while

This just gives them more of a reason.

Those two are legends – whatever they choose to do, nobody can fault them. It’ll be a huge loss to college basketball though.

I prematurely shot my wad, if you will, on what was supposed to be a dry run, and now it looks like I have something of a mess on my hands.

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by Chris Lane on Sep 19, 2011 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions

It's certainly possible

If they go the full 27 months in the Big East, as opposed to breaking that contract earlier, then maybe you’re right.

I don’t think he retires after this season though, no matter what happens conference-wise. Perhaps just wishful thinking. I’ve been in denial of this as a possibility for some time.

http://cusepulp.blogspot.com/

by Lots of Pulp on Sep 19, 2011 3:46 PM EDT up reply actions

I'm going on assumption that they are going to wait the 27 months

By that time, they could be ready.

Boeheim’s quotes from the Monday Morning QB Club (http://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2011/09/boeheim_thinks_uconn_and_possi.html) make him sound a little defeated. He definitely did not want this.

I prematurely shot my wad, if you will, on what was supposed to be a dry run, and now it looks like I have something of a mess on my hands.

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by Chris Lane on Sep 19, 2011 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions

ACC is where we want to be

The argument that Boeheim and Calhoun won’t coach in the ACC is baseless- the only reason they wouldnt coach is that at their tender years they decide to retire. The coaches allegiance is with the schools not the conference. Sure its a different style of play but the ACC will become more melting pot than salad and it will morph into the dominate league that was the Big East.

Further (@chris) your reasoning of joining the ACC with another basketball only team is nonsensical as well. From looking at the Big East one thing can be learned different agenda’s lead to a lack of focus. The factions between football and basketball lead to the dismanteling of the league so why would the ACC now in a position of power due to its unity threaten that in order to prop up the lesser sport ($wise) of basketball.

Our only hope of joining the ACC is that ‘cuse and pitt abide by BE rules and wait 27months after tendering their departure before they actually leave. With over 2 years we would have the ability to build up our program to D1 level and be able to make the argument that we’ll be ready when Pitt and Cuse join. Right now i view this as an us vs Rutgers(uconn is basically a done deal) argument on who gets the last spot (void texas) While we have better basketball and undergraduate academic reputation we also have strong access to the 5th largest media market in Philly. Rutgers on the other hand has a much larger alumni and stronger graduate level academics. That being said for athletics (other than recent football relevance) they have been nonexistent. I think this is a difficult decision for the ACC to make but feel we need to properly show we align very nicely with the ACC.

by bartley rat on Sep 19, 2011 11:03 AM EDT reply actions

Agree with most of what you say

Right now, the ACC is in no rush to add a 15th or 16th school (unless you’re talking about getting ND/Texas). They have a few options right now:

1. Texas & ND – Texas might bring football, but ND absolutely won’t. However, if both offered all-sports minus football, ACC would be right to jump on them. Just don’t see either going there though.

2. UConn & Rutgers – Rutgers doesn’t bring much of value in my opinion, but at least they have proven to be competent football-wise in the last decade. Don’t think BC wants UConn (maybe ‘Cuse doesn’t either) so that could be a big stumbling block.

3. Villanova & 1 more (Georgetown would be the best) – Add these guys as the 15th and 16th members for all sports other than football and ‘Nova promises not to go FBS. Big boost to basketball and restores some great rivalries (’Cuse/G’Town, G’Town/Maryland). Keeps the conference at 14 for football so they can still add two more (and if they added 15 & 16 for football, BE proved 18 for basketball can work).

Villanova could definitely upgrade their football and go ACC – but that’s the least likely scenario in my opinion. Why would ACC commit to a program that is still FCS when they can add FBS programs?

I prematurely shot my wad, if you will, on what was supposed to be a dry run, and now it looks like I have something of a mess on my hands.

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by Chris Lane on Sep 19, 2011 11:11 AM EDT up reply actions

agree with most of what you say as well...

texas and oklahoma are a group deal…ND only makes moves when the big east officially folds which i dont see happening. I see big 12 going down first (texas and oklahoma to pac 12) the big east picking up the pieces and patching together some new league devoid of any cohesion other than being mangled by the process of realignment. (I can’t wait for Baylor vs. st. johns baskeball games) But in any case if ND is forced to move because they wont be allowed to simply park the rest of their sports in a league happy to take them without football- they will go to the Big 10 the logically resting place for them.

2. I mean there really arent many arguments against this option except that the ACC in the driver seat of their future chooses a weak state school (athletically) in Rutgers

3. Georgetown and Maryland have a very strong hatred for each other and i could see maryland saying “us or them” in regards to allowing Gtown. and like i said the “pick and choose” model for sports has been shown to be unsustainable; to me it wouldnt make sense to copy a model that was just shown to fail and lose badly when dominos began to fall(due to lack of shared vision-inherent in different agendas)

4. i agree the least likely scenerio is the ACC taking nova at its word to build its football program- but that is really the only hope we have of remaining nationally relevant. Otherwise i would think the mangled version of the Big East/Big12 leftovers still offers a compelling league (lville, gtown, nova, kansas, kstate) but not what it was. In this last scenario we should look to build our football up in order to make a stronger case next time this realignment occurs(because money talks and football equals money). If we would’ve upgraded our football in the 90’s with uconn we would be the obvious choice for the ACC as it stands now we have our pants at our ankels wondering how we got here. These movements werent a surprise- the speed of the moves were, but the writing had been on the wall for quite a long time. People blame greed i blame the person looking in the mirror.

by bartley rat on Sep 19, 2011 12:48 PM EDT up reply actions

Would rather be in new ACC than new Big East

We retain basketball rivalries with UConn, Pitt and Syracuse. I agree there is just no way G’Town is let in my Maryland.

St. John’s could come to the ACC because they claim to have the NYC market – but in reality that market is dominated by Syracuse, followed by UConn. Hell, there is a bigger Villanova presence there than Rutgers or St. John’s – although with Lavin St. John’s looks to have revitalized the program a bit.

Going in with UConn (with football) is the dream scenario for us. Won’t happen though.

Going in with Notre Dame (without football) is the next best IMO.

I prematurely shot my wad, if you will, on what was supposed to be a dry run, and now it looks like I have something of a mess on my hands.

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by Chris Lane on Sep 19, 2011 1:00 PM EDT up reply actions

Also agree with just about everything here.

Hi guys, Pitt fan here. I’m sure many of you have, I have been constantly transversing these re-alignment talks minute by minute and trying to think over all the possible scenarios. You folks seem to have some great rational bloggers, so I just wanted to throw in some of my thoughts and would love to have a conversation.

1. There is absolutely no way the ACC would take partial sports membership (aka. basketball membership but not football). Honestly, this was a Big East one time thing only, and its hard to imagine a situation where another stable BCS conference would do this due to the different agendas put forth.

2. As Chris said, the best option for Nova to get accepted into the ACC (and it’s a hail-mary long-shot) would be to right now put their football program up to FBS and just somehow pray that ACC “might” take Nova within two years since it does appear as if Pitt and Cuse will have to wait until 2014 to join. But in short, there is no chance that NOVA has of getting into the ACC. As Chris pointed out all too well, the big mistake was Nova not making the FBS move in the mid-90’s. Nova would have a-lot too offer the ACC: they have great academics, accesss to a HUGE TV market (better than any other current BE member actually), and obviously a great basketball program (I forgive you for that Reynolds lay-up). If Nova did have a FBS program right now, I think they would be taken over Pitt, Cuse, Rutgers, UCONN, or any other team out there for the ACC. No-one could offer the ACC what Nova could – if only they currently had a FBS program. Its just too late. As you pointed out Chris, it was short-sightingness by the Nova administrators here.

3. Do not assume the Big East is dead. Nova still has a good home in the BE – especially with the recent reports that WVU has been rejected by the ACC and SEC. To be honest, I think the new league could be better in both football and basketball. Let’s start with football, the loss of Cuse and Pitt is not a huge loss here. Both were just OK programs. Next year, the BE is adding TCU which is now being regraded as a national powerhouse. Also, the additions of the four Big 12 schools would be more than make-up for the loss. This is definitively still a BCS program. And, with basketball, you are losing two powerhouses, however, with the addition of Kansas, you are really only giving up one powerhouse. So, its not that bad. Don’t panic about the Big East here, just let it play out.

4. Question, for all of you. You do have to realize that there is the possibility that the BE won’t have a BCS bid any-more. Do you think this would effect the basketball-only schools even though they don’t play in the BE for football? I have opinions on this, but I would like to hear yours first.

5. And finally, as a Pitt fan, I am very sad that Pitt will not be playing Nova, G-town, even WVU anymore? While I am excited about joining the ACC, I am also very saddened that Pitt won’t be playing the traditional BE rivals anymore.

by PittGuy on Sep 20, 2011 1:47 PM EDT up reply actions

Why not?

But where is the money comin’ from ?

Dikaia Upotheke - Justice Our Foundation

by Lord Willie on Sep 19, 2011 1:30 PM EDT reply actions

What $ are you referring to?

I prematurely shot my wad, if you will, on what was supposed to be a dry run, and now it looks like I have something of a mess on my hands.

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by Chris Lane on Sep 19, 2011 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions

If MD, BC, Syracuse and UVA break-even in sports..

how is Nova going to come close to paying their fair share to the North Carolina mafia? Schools with $60M athletic budgets cannot make money, are you ready for that situation?

Dikaia Upotheke - Justice Our Foundation

by Lord Willie on Sep 19, 2011 2:06 PM EDT reply actions

You just scared me

I wasn’t aware of that – that’s incredible.

The one thing I can say is that we won’t be playing football if we come – I think we’ve all come to that conclusion. So we aren’t going to have that outlay of money. That surely means a lower rev-share on the TV deal (no football money). But that TV deal would be big enough on the basketball side to really help us.

I prematurely shot my wad, if you will, on what was supposed to be a dry run, and now it looks like I have something of a mess on my hands.

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by Chris Lane on Sep 19, 2011 2:40 PM EDT up reply actions